Vancouver's owner is gone, for suspected cheating.

[Cringer]

Jeff brought to my attention that Vancouver's renegotiations looked kind of odd today. Things seemed to be very much like the known 'minimum-salary' bug. Low base salaries, not even close to what the guys requested when I checked on one before I went to the dentist.

While I was gone Jeff ran some more checks which I think he will explain since he has the data on those checks.

I am convinced of cheating, in one way or the other. Exploiting a known bug (maybe min-sal was not fixed all the way?) or by using Commish mode to test his export, to get the exact amounts he offered guys.

I won't go for cheating. I am going pretty much zero tolerance in this case because it just seems way to obvious to me it is a cheat. I don't even need him to explain, but he can try if he wants to.

[HammeringJohnson]

wow.

good cops!

[Matt]

WOW!

I'd like to hear this explanation

[sovstar]

The first screenshot shows what Richard Burgos was looking for in an extension before today's files were ran. The next screenshot shows what he was given.

Now besides the fact that the contract strongly resembles a minsal-like contract, there is much more to the story here. I ran multiple tests offering Burgos (pre-today's sim) nearly similar offers. If he was offered just 10k less in bonus the deal was rejected. If I offered 10k less salary in the 3rd year, the deal was rejected. If I offered him 10k less in salary in the last year the deal was rejected. Of course, I also offered him what Justin/Vancouver offered him and it was accepted.

I did that test with a couple of other guys he signed to extensions today as well. This is what I strongly suspect he has been doing (yes, it's all possible):

1) Makes a "test" export in which he offers the player a shady minsal-like contract
2) Imports that export in commissioner mode and checks to see if it will be accepted. If it's not, then you start over at step #1 until you figure out *exactly* how low he will go.

It's either that or he knows a lot about what the AI likes, ie he knows certain forumulas.

[Suicane]

Indeed, he either opened the game in commish mode and tested, or he has figured out a formula, either way he's circumventing the spirit of the league and needs to no longer be a part of the league.

[Matt]

great eyes. 8)

[Matt]

doesn't he commish in another league?

[sovstar]

doesn't he commish in another league?

Yes. He's the commissioner of the Primetime Football League.

[SteveBsFan]

I hate to blame people w/o hearing both sides, but this definitely looks shady. Good catch.

[MrBigglesworth]

From the PFL rules:

Cheating or taking advantage of bugs within Front Office Football will not be tolerated. If found cheating or exploiting bugs, commissioner will assume that the GM knew what he was doing. As a commissioner, I will do my best to educate all GMs on game exploitations. GMs are expected to avoid those exploitations.

• A majority of the time, cheating isn’t a oblivious action, and will be treated as such. So, if you think an action is questionable, talk to a commissioner before doing it.

• Sanctions will be brought against a GM found cheating.

• If a GM performs a suspicious action, such as being able to sign a player for well below his asking price (a known bug), a GM will avoid sanctions from the league if the commissioners are immediately informed.

[Cringer]

Talked with Justin on AIM. He doesn't seem to argue his much, and I don't buy his arguements anyways.

Cringer63: you there?
jshipman9476: yeah
Cringer63: I think you have cheated in some way in the Imperial League with your contracts. You are not going to be Vancouver's owner any longer.
jshipman9476: ok
jshipman9476: i don't feel i cheated but whatever is best for the league...i understand
Cringer63: did you run the Imperial League in commish mode to test your exports? That seems like the most likely thing here to me.
jshipman9476: nope, just lowered the amounts each year and the bonus...someone had told me long ago that a player requested much higher than what he was willing to renegotiate for.
Cringer63: the problem with this, is if the salaries you gave these guys are adjusted in anyway, by the slightest amount, they reject the offers. Hard to believe that with atleast these two players you got some magic number just right. Sorry but to me it looks like cheating, I am pretty convinced of it from what I have seen.
jshipman9476: i had never tried it in an actual MP league before but did setup a dumby MP league and look for the different types of players to get an idea of what they would accept (star players, average joes, scrubs, etc.) and that is what i based my offers off of.
Cringer63: Ok. Well, I have pretty much made up my mind already. I won't slander you to other leagues or FOFC, but I have told the other owners in the Imperial League. That pretty much all I have to say man. Later
jshipman9476: later

[Matt]

, I will do my best to educate all GMs on game exploitations.

hmm

[Jave]

I am sorry to see a fellow owner get the boot for any reason, but am glad that Jeff was on his toes in noticing something unusual and taking action.

Isn't George Bush up? I am not sure if he is ready to take on a team yet after what happened, but I would LOVE for him to be in my division, that smack talking piece of shit!

[Matt]

Talked with Justin on AIM. He doesn't seem to argue his much, and I don't buy his arguements anyways.

Cringer63: you there?
jshipman9476: yeah
Cringer63: I think you have cheated in some way in the Imperial League with your contracts. You are not going to be Vancouver's owner any longer.
jshipman9476: ok
jshipman9476: i don't feel i cheated but whatever is best for the league...i understand
Cringer63: did you run the Imperial League in commish mode to test your exports? That seems like the most likely thing here to me.
jshipman9476: nope, just lowered the amounts each year and the bonus...someone had told me long ago that a player requested much higher than what he was willing to renegotiate for.
Cringer63: the problem with this, is if the salaries you gave these guys are adjusted in anyway, by the slightest amount, they reject the offers. Hard to believe that with atleast these two players you got some magic number just right. Sorry but to me it looks like cheating, I am pretty convinced of it from what I have seen.
jshipman9476: i had never tried it in an actual MP league before but did setup a dumby MP league and look for the different types of players to get an idea of what they would accept (star players, average joes, scrubs, etc.) and that is what i based my offers off of.
Cringer63: Ok. Well, I have pretty much made up my mind already. I won't slander you to other leagues or FOFC, but I have told the other owners in the Imperial League. That pretty much all I have to say man. Later
jshipman9476: later

this is BS. I played SP careers for a long time before entering this MP league. To cut a salary down exactly to where the guy will accept the offer is like hitting a needle in a haystack. In a SP game, you have the time to try as many times in 1 stage. In MP you're limited because you're only allowed 1 offer per stage.

I don't believe him. I'd like him to splain himself

[Cringer]

For right now I am passing on making a correction of this. The new owner is going to be screwed in enough ways as it is.

BTW, the waiting list is out of date, I am going through my emails tonight to see who is up next. I will emails guys tonight about the team.

Right now I need to leave. I have to be on the truck in 15 minutes.