Amateur Draft to Commence on Sunday the 5th

[sovstar]

Dave is going to be setting up a page where the commish login can reset any or all passwords, so that's cool.

[roadrash]

w00t

I just got an e-mail from Dave telling me that the max. password length is eight. I could have sworn that I checked for that possibility though. Either way, glad the problem is solved.

Good, so now will you quit your whinning, pussy?

[sovstar]

w00t

I just got an e-mail from Dave telling me that the max. password length is eight. I could have sworn that I checked for that possibility though. Either way, glad the problem is solved.

Good, so now will you quit your whinning, pussy?

It's whining, bitch. And yes.. yes I will.
:P

[roadrash]

w00t

I just got an e-mail from Dave telling me that the max. password length is eight. I could have sworn that I checked for that possibility though. Either way, glad the problem is solved.

Good, so now will you quit your whinning, pussy?

It's whining, bitch. And yes.. yes I will.
:P

now you are resorting to nit-picking. ..Or did I spell that wrong?
I think I'm gonn make the championship game this year just to whoop your ass. . .but that mean you'd have to make it as well, and that ain't gonna happen. ..

[roadrash]

Re: Amateur Draft to Commence on Sunday the 5th

What kind of time limit? Should it change after the first round, second round...? When should the clock be on downtime?

Since your actually asking for input, I'll put aside the insults and give you some.

First round should be 12 hour limit. Trades take time, people have work schedules and some of us sleep for a few hours a day. 12 hours, if everyone is checking at least two to three times a day, will give everyone a chance for a trade negotiation, finalizing, and league admin. Think it's too long? Well, the first two picks will more than likely be done in about 10 minutes. In fact, I think they are done. I actually think the top 5 or so will be done in the first 8-12 hours. The next tean are going to take some time though, and it will start speeding up later on. Of course this is based on my experience with the NFL, not FoF.

The second round then should be decreased to about 8 hours, and third through 7th should be 4 hours.

I'd also like to schedule a meeting/get together when the draft kicks off. We can do this thorugh the board chat, or AIM. Technically, this could be a live draft then, give or take a few players. It will also get a buinch of people online to work trades as well. I could set up a mIRC server at home, if it's still free, for everyone to use instead of AIM. That way we have a relieable chat room for the draft.

[sovstar]

Re: Amateur Draft to Commence on Sunday the 5th

First round should be 12 hour limit. Trades take time, people have work schedules and some of us sleep for a few hours a day. 12 hours, if everyone is checking at least two to three times a day, will give everyone a chance for a trade negotiation, finalizing, and league admin. Think it's too long? Well, the first two picks will more than likely be done in about 10 minutes. In fact, I think they are done. I actually think the top 5 or so will be done in the first 8-12 hours. The next tean are going to take some time though, and it will start speeding up later on. Of course this is based on my experience with the NFL, not FoF.

The second round then should be decreased to about 8 hours, and third through 7th should be 4 hours.

Wow. To be quite honest, I disagree with your time limits a bunch. 12 hours? What is the point of having an automated draft utility if you allow guys to take 12 hours to make their pick? The point isn't to make sure that every guy has finished his work day, ate dinner with the family, and is free at his computer without distraction. The point is to allow enough time for those that can check things out four or five times a day so that they can make a "live" pick. If you don't think that you will be around when your slot comes up then you'll need to set up your preference list. You will/should have some sort of an idea as to when your pick will be up.

As for trades, we can't allow guys to sit on the clock for hours trying to finish off a deal. It's just not feasible at all. Pretty much the only guys that will be able to be involved in trade-making will be the guys that can check in numerous times throughout the day.

Like I noted above, I'm not even sure that we can change the utilities set parameters. If we can't, then I think it might be best (if at all possible) to do the first round on the board. And probably with a 3-4 hour time limit. I really think that you are underestimating the time that it takes to do get through one of these things. I've seen some nightmare cases.

In the CFL, their last draft took 19 days. This was with two or three live drafting sessions in which 6-9 guys gathered in an AIM chat room and made their picks live. The rest of the league either had to submit a list or allow the computer to make their picks for them. The first round was done on the board and it took over 9 days. Do we want this?

It's just my opinion that we can't allow all that much freedom. If you give a guy 8 hours to make a pick, the majority of the time he'll take all eight. Look at it this way. The eNFL went with the rules that can be found by using the link in my second post in this thread, ie one hour per pick and the clock runs from 10a-11p. Dave says that they are able to get done with the draft in around a week.. that's right, a week.

The last point I'm going to make is that this isn't the most active of leagues and this should almost be expected with the schedule that we follow. With that said, I think guys are going to have to realize that this isn't going to be the dream of all drafts. If you've been through one before, then you know what I'm talking about. We've got to get through this in 1 1/2 to 2 weeks max. You will have to use the preference lists at some point no matter what.

[dberner30]

I have done a few drafts and understand Sovs point. I dont agree with him though. The first round should be slower to allow more give and take and fun in the draft. Speed isnt the goal and never should be the goal. The league plays one game a week. WHy should the draft blaze past in a week. Lets enjoy the offseason but not let it drag too much. We are starting the draft before the FA stage is completed so when is that projected to end. There is no purpose to rushing the draft just to get it done. Enjoy it. Bask in the glory of it. Then once the first few rds are done speed it up significantly.

Now before you jump on me and call me names keep in mind I am not advocating that we go a week or two with the first rd. Run the clock at 8 hours or six hours and go with it for a few days and see how it goes. We can always tighten it then if we need to do so.

[roadrash]

After looking at the scedule, I guess the 12 hour limit is more of a wish than feasable. Most of that comes from the fact that not enough owners check their PMs in a reasonable time, or just ignore me. I've made 3 offers last week and only heard back from one, which I just finalized. Maybe that last post was out of frustration, disregard it, let me start over.

I guess maybe a better way of doing this is to divide out the days we have. 8 days to do the draft in, 7 rounds, 32 picks each round, 224 picks total.

Round	Time Limit	Total Hours
First	2 hr each	64 hours
2nd-3rd	1 hr each	64 hours
4th-7th	20 min each	43 hours

This will take just over 7 days to complete. How is this?

[sovstar]

I have done a few drafts and understand Sovs point. I dont agree with him though. The first round should be slower to allow more give and take and fun in the draft. Speed isnt the goal and never should be the goal. The league plays one game a week. WHy should the draft blaze past in a week. Lets enjoy the offseason but not let it drag too much. We are starting the draft before the FA stage is completed so when is that projected to end. There is no purpose to rushing the draft just to get it done. Enjoy it. Bask in the glory of it. Then once the first few rds are done speed it up significantly.

Now before you jump on me and call me names keep in mind I am not advocating that we go a week or two with the first rd. Run the clock at 8 hours or six hours and go with it for a few days and see how it goes. We can always tighten it then if we need to do so.

Good post. I know you to be one of the more active owners in various leagues, so if there were 32 guys like you in a league I think everything would indeed be perfect. Of course, that isn't the case. I just don't think it would be long before guys start to realize how much it sucks when only 3 or 4 picks are made in a day. It's entirely possible and I've seen it happen before. Our most recent Fresno GM made roll call two weeks ago and now he isn't to be heard from. There's less than 20 exports coming in each sim. The fact of the matter is that we will need to be strict to streamline things. It's just the way I think it will need to be with the group of owners we got.

Guys, I really don't know all of the answers and I don't want you to think that you're not being heard either. Honestly, I'm a little disappointed that Cringer never brought this topic up earlier as we are getting very near to the point where we've got to start the draft. I'm left in the position of the middle man, so please bare with me. And I do play the role of devil's advocate more often than not, this I realize. Someone has to.


Just keep sharing your thoughts.

[sovstar]

After looking at the scedule, I guess the 12 hour limit is more of a wish than feasable. Most of that comes from the fact that not enough owners check their PMs in a reasonable time, or just ignore me. I've made 3 offers last week and only heard back from one, which I just finalized. Maybe that last post was out of frustration, disregard it, let me start over.

Don't worry about the frustration, it's definitely passed through me as well. For me it's just become a given that some guys aren't going to be as timely as I'd like them to be. And I've just got to remember that everyone walks in a different pair of shoes.

Now back to the draft. Admittingly, the one hour per pick definitely caught me off guard and it does frighten me a little bit. Mostly because I'm not so sure that it could work for this league, at least not for the first round. I want guys to enjoy the draft experience and have the ability to make trades during the draft. But how do we compromise? Right now I'm thinking that IF we can NOT change the draft util's parameters, ie one hour per pick, then we shouldn't use it until the second round. I'd think that it would be possible to start using the util later than what it would expect. We would carry out the first round with a board draft, although I'm certain that it would take at least five days itself.

Just realize that a board draft requires dedication from everyone as a whole and I'm not convinced at this point that everyone is ready to make that committment. Am I wrong? Everyone know that I can be a little overbearing sometimes. I regret calling guys out that didn't vote in the Owners Awards. But what does it tell you when nine guys voted (in a week) for an award that ended up going to a player on a team whose owner ditched out on them? Yes, it wasn't mandatory, but should it have to be?

[roadrash]

You know, what is stopping us from starting the draft now. . with no lime limit per pick until Dec 5th when we start enforcing the time limits. . .

The first two picks are Oakland, and I bet Jave is ready to make his selections, i bet I can even guess which players he takes. . .So, is Houston on the Clock?

Cringer doesn't have a first round pick, so he isn't going to miss anything unless he wants to trade up, which I doubt.

[Jave]

Just out of curiousity, do the PMs sit in the outbox until someone actually reads them? Then they move to the sentbox?

The answer is yes, untill the person logs on, it sits in your outbox. I believe, once they log on, it gets shot to their inbox.

As far as the draft....the first two picks are obvious, Connell and Hamilton are already off the board, however, I have been in drafts where I was picking 15-30 and I can tell you for a fact, if an owner has 8 hours to make a pick, some will take 4-6 of them. It may not be their fault, however, some are just plain lazy, and don't spend 10 minutes to fill out a preference list. This can make the first two rounds last 2-4 days, which is just insane. I have to say, we need to institute strict time limits to force certain lazy players to spend a half hour out their day to create a preference lists, or have their scout pick for them, otherwise, this draft will take a month....and I am serious. And after the draft, we still have the second FA period and then training camp, so lets do what we can to speed this up and get to what people really enjoy.....kicking each others ass on the field!

[ThomasG]

Well, as some of you know, I'll have a problem of a different kind regarding the draft. I will only be available from 11 am to around 6 pm to make my picks. As I understand, you even can't calculate when you're on the clock since it re-starts right when one guy makes his choice.

I really don't want to rely on a preference list because I have specific perceptions about the positions I need and I don't know how to prevent the system to pick two players from the same position when using a list.

I think I can safely say that if one of my picks comes up in the above timeframe, I won't need much time for it as I'm really curious about my first online draft, and I will do my part to make it as quick as possible. But if there's just a slight possibility, I want to make each of my picks on my own.

Sorry about ranting a bit, but I really look forward to the whole thing and want to enjoy it as much as possible.

[Kobeck]

my thoughts - like anyone is interested

The expansion draft went off failry well, took 8 or so hours but we really plowed thru some picks, guys who could not hang had their scout select for them. I say everyone should have their first round preference list ready if they won't be available for a live draft, could still use the utility just have a chat board going at the same time. should have the first round done in no time.
Then start using the utility for real and I bet the second round goes fairly fast. I bet that if guys knew they would not be available that they could either give Cringer a detailed list instead of the automated preference list, I did this on the expansion draft - just gotta trust the guy. This would allow the guys who were there to select away and the guys not there would have their selections either automated, private, or with detailed instructions provided to Cringer beforehand, semi-private.
I say the final 4 rounds should use the utility and if guys got no preference list then let the scout do the selecting.
This would mean that the guys wishing to trade during the draft would have to be on top of it, but they should be anyways.

Anyhow that is my thoughts as I see no reason why this should take more than a day or so - I say we try and start on a saturday and finish before Cringer leaves monday or tuesday.

[Warhammer]

I would say if we could plan on doing a round/day, then it would really help some of us. I can plan one round pretty quick, and identify some guys I think will be there in rounds 2/3, but trying to rank 90+ players is pretty tough.

That said, one round/day will let us see who is sticking around, and allow us to see any runs on a particular position on draft day. Ideally, we could all be on at the same time, but I know for a fact that I will not be available until after 5 PM (at the earliest) on Sunday.